Talk:Rouga
combos I've discovered so far (demo) not so great at fighting games but the page is so empty. 5B (Midscreen) 5B, 5C, 6A, 6B, j.214B, (66), 5B, j.B, (j.214A) 2.8K (omit 66 if you're 2P side or closer to corner) (214A) can be exchanged for 5C 2.95K. More damage but sacrifices time for oki. 214D 3.15K uses a special. that's all I really got; most of my other combos are just variations of above ^ Optimization Okay, so I checked out this optimized midscreen combo ender, and really I don't feel like it's better. You get maybe 200 extra damage for a much higher execution requirement and the loss of the ability to use the combo in the corner. Sounds like a poor deal to me. :After a little more testing, looks like it's just very character specific on how difficult it is to nail 6a 5b 6a 623a as an ender. In all honesty, I would use a more universally friendly ender for real play. I totally didn't realize that the 2147d doesn't count as a bounce in the super combo though, good catch. In playing around some, I think I've found the most optimized relaunch after 214b as a result of checking a number of variations that delayed 214b can link from, which actually makes for plenty more damage without needing the more difficult ender. The new super combo does 4403 vs full health Sanzou (5475 vs class 3 guts - holy shit). (This may have turned out to be character specific, gonna test more before posting anything) Thanks for the inspiration. LoliSauce 07:31, November 19, 2011 (UTC) ::Maybe 6a 5c j.a j.b j.214a would be easier, without losing too much damage. (JohnGrimm's variant replaces the last j.214a with a boost j.b j.214a, but I personally don't feel it's worth using the boost, except when you're sitting on 3 of them I suppose.) Mengjun 12:04, November 19, 2011 (UTC) :Meterless Midscreen BnB should never have a manditory boost, since they're such a rare commodity (and are generally more suited for pressure/mixup). Also, in live play, the 623a gives superior positioning along with ample oki time, which 100% beats out a little extra damage in my book. In the corner, Rouga has 3 viable overhead options that he can confirm without boost/meter, and it denies the enemy the ability to backdash out of staggered pressure. I was looking to optimize the first 214b relaunch (maybe I should call it the rebounce?), and 5bc (delay) 214b was working against most of the cast for both highest damage and least proration. Unfortunately, I couldn't seem to get it to land against Heita, so that option seems ousted. There's some other variations of 214b rebounce I want to play around with (2c 6a delay 214b seems prime contender atm) but I have to try some extensive testing to make sure it's universal. Some of the cast have such wonky-ass air hitboxes. LoliSauce 20:34, November 20, 2011 (UTC) ::Ah yea, you're right. j.214a ender does give similar amounts of oki, but I forgot it doesn't necessarily carry the opponent to the corner. ::Finding truly universal combos seems to be pretty hard though, because of the weird quirks that some characters have. Ren seems to fall faster, causing 5B and 2C to whiff after launching with 2C xx 214A xx 214B, but variants that work on him do not necessarily work on other characters. Some characters seem to fall slower than most other characters too, and hitboxes can be troublesome too, as you already pointed out. Long story short, if it's only one or two characters it is not working against, I wouldn't worry about it too much. ::Back on track, from what I noticed, 2C 6A delay 214B only nets you more damage if it's done while the proration is low, (for most of Rouga's practical combo's this means: before you use 214A for the first time). Mengjun 22:08, November 20, 2011 (UTC) Damage Totals Also, what's up with taking damage totals with guts on? I dunno about anyone else, but I'd much rather have numbers that are actually relative to what I'm going to see in real combat. Using the grossly inflated guts numbers seems impractical, as whether you're testing via guts or testing for practical damage, you'll have to test vs two opponents (class 2/3 vs Highest/Lowest def mod). Regardless, the contributors need to get unified on how we all are listing things. LoliSauce 04:39, November 19, 2011 (UTC) :My main problem with actual damage numbers is that they tend to even vary depending on whether the character is at high health or not. Most ridiculous example would be Mecha-Heita, who has a very high def mod at high health (70%, highest in the game, together with *low* health Sanzou), but a very low def mod at low health (100%, lowest in the game). In that respect, I feel that the "-guts" damage portrays the actual damage more correctly, if you take the character's effective HP into account, and those numbers tend to vary between 11k (Kunagi) and 13k (Sanzou). Mengjun 12:04, November 19, 2011 (UTC) ::Okay, I can understand where you're coming from on this better now. I still feel that because fluctuation (generally just degredation) of damage relative to health is very common in fighters -especially modern titles - players are always under the assumption that damage totals given are never going to be exact representations, and automatically take relative defense into account. As a player, I couldn't care less about trying to memorize (or even worse, constantly cross reference) any wiki info for relative life totals in comparison to unmodified damage or whatever else when I'm looking to grind out practice or play a friend. I just want to know that x combo does around y% life average, has z properties, and here's how to do it. :::You got a point there, I guess it is easier to have the full range of the actual damage, instead of just the "-guts" damage. Still, I find the "-guts" damage to be useful when comparing damage of character specific combos. Mengjun 21:43, November 20, 2011 (UTC) ::Rereading my own paragraph, I feel I should apologize if I'm coming off as rude or mindlessly bashing your method. Really, I'm just looking for the most simple and practical way for people to just hit up the wiki, get quick info, and be on their way. Frankly, I was baffled at what -guts and -beats were at all until pretty recently, since they aren't explained anywhere (not in the game nor here on the wiki) and cannot come up in live play whatsoever. I keep mulling it over and coming to the conclusion of "Why use a training mode option to adjust damage totals in a way that you can't ever see in real play? Wouldn't that just be an advocate of confusion?" Further thinking it over, aren't there more steps involved in interpretation of guts damage (guts total > calculate percentage of relative total life > adjust by def %'s = rough expected damage) compared to max health damage (damage total > adjust by def %'s = rough expected damage), which means more steps to mentally guestimate while in real play? LoliSauce 20:34, November 20, 2011 (UTC) :::Don't worry about that, if anyone should apologize, it would be me, for changing stuff without discussing it thoroughly. ^^; Mengjun 21:43, November 20, 2011 (UTC)